Kim Deal Reflects on ‘Really Fun’ Experience Opening for Olivia Rodrigo & Her Final Project With Steve Albini

For nearly 40 years, Kim Deal has maintained a formidable presence in the annals of rock n’ roll, first as the bassist for the Pixies and then as the leader of The Breeders.

Now, six years after the last Breeders LP All Nerve, Ms. Deal returns Nov. 22 with Nobody Loves You More (via 4AD Records), an album that showcases the talents of the self-proclaimed ‘70s rocker from Dayton, Ohio, in a different light from anything she’s done before. And while this isn’t her first time going solo — having released the magnificent Pacer in 1995 under the aegis The Amps as well as a 10-song white label 7-inch vinyl series in 2013 — this is the first proper album released in her own name. It’s something her fans have been clamoring for since she first emerged onto the scene in January 1986 after answering an ad in the Boston Phoenix to join the Pixies — or at least since fans first heard her sing lead on “Gigantic.” And she does not disappoint.

Produced by the late Steve Albini, with songs dating back as early as 2011, Nobody Loves You More finds Deal experimenting with different sounds and tones, including strings, a horn section, pedal steel guitar and even a ukulele. At times it feels almost like a Julie London record from the early ‘60s, as on songs such as the touching, personal “Are You Mine” (which addresses her mom’s Alzheimer’s disease), “Summerland” and the opening title track. Elsewhere, “Coast” finds her wasting away in her own private “Margaritaville,” while “Big Ben Beat” sees her getting industrial with Fay Milton and Ayse Hassan of Savages fame.

But longtime fans need not worry, as the indelible loud softness that Deal has mastered over the decades remains firmly intact as well across such highlights as “Disobedience,” “I’ll Come Running” and “A Good Time Pushed.” Helping Kim along the way is a host of collaborators, including Breeders alum Mando Lopez, twin sister Kelley Deal, Jim Macpherson and Britt Walford, Jack Lawrence of The Raconteurs and Raymond McGinley of Teenage Fanclub.

Billboard caught up with Deal to discuss working with Albini on the new album, opening for Olivia Rodrigo and more.

Between JD Vance and “they’re eating the dogs,” your home state of Ohio has unfortunately been in the headlines for all the wrong reasons. What do you think of what’s going on in the country?

I used to think, “Oh my God, what’s happening? Things are happening. It’s never been this bad.” And then I just look around and see, you know, women couldn’t get a credit card in 1974. Black folks couldn’t drink out of the same fountain in the ‘50s. And I think people have always been this s—ty, man, millennia after millennia. I think it’s just the human experience. There’s always been a warmongering, hate-filled group to reactivate people. It’s always been like this.

It must’ve been a thrill, however, for The Breeders to open up those shows for Olivia Rodrigo in New York and L.A. What was that experience like?

It was really fun to get to play with her. There was a part of the show where she sits at the piano, and she has a bit where she talks about the opening band — because she’s a professional — and she mentions how her life has a before “Cannonball,” and then it has an after “Cannonball.” She said she listened to the song and it blew her mind open, or it blew her world apart, or something like that, which is really cool to know that music does have the power to transform one’s experience, being able to listen to a song and have it just blast my perspective wide open. Like there’s something more.

Nowadays we can check out a song by going on the internet and just checking out where the artist is from. But it’s more than just about where someone is from, but rather using the imagination of what could be an adventurous idea of looking at what could possibly be out there that I’ve never seen before, a feeling that I’ve never felt before. It’s not something specific; it’s just a feeling.

It’s wild to think that the time between Guts and Last Splash is the same distance as the years between Last Splash and a lot of the surf music from three early ‘60s that’s inspired your sound through the years …

I love surf guitar music for sure. There were these gateway songs in my youth that pointed me there, like I’ll hear “Tequila” and I’ll start looking for similar songs. It’s a little different now than it was then, because you could look that song up online and you can have this vast encyclopedia of all surf music ever done.

One of the locales of your new album is Florida. Your parents used to rent a house in the Keys, and you’d go down there with them?

My family was getting old, but they liked to go down there. I didn’t. I’m not a Florida person. I’m not a beach person. I don’t like the sand. I don’t like the hot sun. I don’t like water sports. But since my family was getting older, we all loaded the cars together and we drove down and we would be there to help them. I stayed with them, and I did it year after year. And then when they got too old to go, I found I enjoyed going. I would bring guitars down. They would go back early, and I would stay back with my guitars, because I liked the view of the ocean.

“Are You Mine?” is such a touching song about your mom and her final years suffering from Alzheimer’s.

She passed away in 2020, right before COVID. Like the day before. We were happy, because it would have been horrible to go through COVID with an Alzheimer’s patient.

Do you think of her often?

When I think of my mother, she had been diagnosed in 2002, so she lasted for 18 years. So when I think of Mom, I think of her only as that person. And I don’t know if she was like that. Like, I can’t remember her as a thriving person. My dad, I remember him as a human being and he’s Dad. But my mom, I don’t have anything other than nothing. But she did love to eat ice cream, I’ll tell you that. Put a smile on her face.

It makes me think that maybe I wanna leave early, so people could remember who I was. But, at the same time, I like ice cream, too. So do I really care if they think I’m a muttering poopy butt? Hopefully I’ll live long enough to have some sort of dementia. Just maybe a little bit, anyway. My mom was 69 when it hit, so …

There’s one song in particular on the album, “Summerland,” that really seems to capture the beauty and grace of Nobody Loves You More. How did the ukulele come into play on this song?

Steve Albini’s wife is from Hawaii. So when they got married, they wanted to go to Hawaii. So they invited us, and they wanted me to do the music, the wedding march. So me and [twin sister] Kelley [Deal] got some ukuleles and we gave them as a gift to the whole wedding party too, because everybody there at the wedding is a musician. We got a bunch of ukuleles and we all played the wedding march and we also played a Dolly Parton song, “He’s Gonna Have to Marry Me Now.” And so as a gift, Steve and his wife gave us a ukulele. So I threw it in the car on the way down to Florida, and I just thought I’d mess around with it. And all of a sudden my fingers were making these four chord formations and I really liked it. So when I told [Josephine Wiggs], the Breeders’ bass player, “Jo, I got this ukulele song, let me play it for you,” she was like, “Absolutely not!” Because she’s a goth girl, big time. She’s old school goth. She didn’t want any ukulele on a Breeders record, so I knew it could be a solo song.

The strings on this album are stunning as well.

[Albini] was just so good at recording everything. You know, everybody thinks that Steve is just like these three man bands and he just sets them up. “I’m a plumber, this is what I do.” But he was really professional and he is gonna do the best job he can to make your band sound like your band. And record it in the best, most professional way. He did a Japanese band called Mono, which is like tons of strings. He also worked with Mucca Pazza, who is this huge horn conglomerate from Chicago and recorded all of them.

So for like that “Summerland” song, I called Steve and I said, “I’ve got a string section in my head. Every time I play this song, I hear it. I don’t know how many pieces it is.” And he would just let me know, like, “Okay, we can do a double string section, and when that happens they usually use a low-end phase so they can sound as one.” He was so knowledgeable about everything. Like Kelley says, he answers in paragraphs. He was thorough, and he had his wits about him. So then he made me realize it was a film score that I was hearing in my head.

So anyway, the players come, he knows who’s coming, and there’s like a dozen people. And every single headphone box works. Come on. When you go into the studio and you’ve got more than like five people, one of the headphone boxes isn’t gonna work, right? Not with Steve. Whatever you’re gonna do, everything’s gonna work. Everything is on point. And we’re going to tape, not digital, and all the microphones are set up. So this guy who I’m used to with this superseding reputation as just being this punk guy is just so prepared, so professional. The players all line up and come in and sit down, and there’s no harried fuss about what’s happening and what isn’t working. Everybody knows what they are doing. So me and the string arranger Susan Voelz, who was in Poi Dog Pondering, are in there. We look at Steve, and he goes, “Okay, well, it sounds great. We don’t need to do another one, right?” So we just did it in one take.

Strings can sort of be like guitar. You get too many on there, and then they sound weak and soft. More guitars don’t make something harder. And you know, the reason why I wanted strings was because every time I picked up my guitar and started singing the melodies, I just had it all in my head. I heard it all.

Was this album your final project with Steve?

I finished recording with him in the fall of 2022. This was the last thing I did with him. I can’t believe it. You know, his album, that Shellac album, they had been working on it for years, like a decade. He died on a Monday night, but I found out on Tuesday. Then the new Shellac record [To All Trains] was released that Friday. It was so close. They had tour schedules and everything. It’s still hard to believe.

That flamingo on the cover, is it real?

No, it’s CGI. We tried to get a real one. There’s a farm in West Virginia. [The label] called evidently, and they said, “We’d like to get one of those flamingos into a photo shoot.” And the people said, “You don’t know much about flamingos, do you? They are very aggressive animals. You would have to drug them within an inch of their life for them to be held or even reined in on the set.” We were like, OK then lol.

Next year marks the 35th anniversary of The Breeders’ first album. Any plans to tour?

I want to. We are supposed to do something in March and then maybe some other shows. So that’s why the Pod 35 is such a surprise to me.

Is there any plan for a commemoration?

I’m not sure! I’m shocked at how long it’s been. The Breeders just did three shows. We did Ohana, Pearl Jam’s festival in Dana Point in Orange County, Calif., which was a really cool festival. We came out and played all of Pod, and then we played Last Splash back to back.

Do you ever talk to your old Breeders partner Tanya Donnelly?

My gosh, Belly played shows with us last year. We did a run down the West Coast and they came out and played shows. She came up on stage and played with us every night that we played together. You know, Britt Walford, who also played on Pod, he plays on the new record. He plays on “Summerland” and he plays on “Nobody Loves You More.” He just lives in Kentucky, which is like an hour and a half away from me in Ohio.

Any plans to do a solo tour?

I want to. We are supposed to do something in March and then maybe some other shows. So that’s why Pod 35 is such a surprise to me.